Trading Against Yourself Stragegy TAYS

[JanaPP]

This very first post #1 will probably be changed frequently to reflect the current condition of principles etc for this particular thread so new people can be up with the times simply by reading this informative article.

Throughout my studies in the couple of years I've become a trader, such as many of you I've tried several distinct ways and styles of trading. It's been my experience that most of the time when I enter a transaction, price goes contrary to my place if not right away then soon after before it turns back around and heads in the first planned direction. Although I've had and do have any success with experts as my bread and butter trading tools I've always wished to be able to trade successfully with the manual process; consequently, TAYS the Trading Yourself Stragegy or to set it in a better way, Trade What You DON'T See.

Because of this trading metric, though it may very well be the norm for the majority of traders most of the time, I decided to try something a bit different. So I took a number of the standard indiors, put together a very simple trading plan but when it came time to pulling the trigger, rather than clicking the buy for buy and sell for sale, I decided to attempt and click the contrary box instead.

Quite simply, if it were a buy signal I Had click the market box and visa versa. In my amazement I finally began manually trading rather successfully. The trick to this as if I need to tell you is how the mind reacts to this type of twisted thinking, it could be more difficult than you may imagine initially but on the other hand it's quite fun and gives a gaming flavor to trading so much as I have observed to this point.

Because of this, I was considering taking a demo or just a nano account (since at least this would be live) and experiment reside here onforexintuitivewith you intelligent people employing this egy.

Therefore my questions before I choose to begin is this are:
1. Is there some interest in this type of trading experiment.

2. Has or is anyone doing this since I do not want to become a taboo contributor to FF.

I appreciate the feedback.

If there's very little interest I'll just leave this at the and thank you.
Otherwise I will begin trading this way posting the transactions bad or good and I took them that way. I'll also be open to advice from all persons who can provide valuable tidbits of trading assistance and information to further the cause. Lastly, if I continue this thread I will post not only the transactions (best I can) but also the account from week to week.

Thank you Beforehand,


Edit: ADDED INFO BELOW 5-12-2010 11:55 MST
Alright! I have developed a very simple trading format that should be a consistant loser. Why? Because it's going to adhere to the indictors that should lead us to riches but always causes reductions... right? Https://forexintuitive.com/attachments/1527986727.png well we will see.

Below I will list the indiors I am planing to begin with.
I am starting this thread using a demo account, one that I had about $700. I believe I'll probably restart it in a while so that which is zero would out if things appear to go well.

Caveat:
I reserve the right to change and rechange the principles and the indior record anytime. https://forexintuitive.com/attachments/1527986727.png

VERY SIMPLE TRADING RULES:
1. TRADE WHEN A MAJORITY OF INDICATORS AGREE IN A DIRECTION
2. CHOSE TRADE BY CLICKING ON THE OPPOSITE DIRECTION THE STOCHASTICS POINT (for now)
3. TP SL WILL BE COMPUTED USING THE FIB EXPANSION FOR THE TIME BEING.
4. ANY TIMEFRAME IS FAIR GAME BUT I'LL PROBABLY KEEP IT IN THE 1HR TO 4HR AND SOMETIMES I'LL USE THE 15M TOO.
EDIT: adding into the principles here
5. After within close range of profit goal and in nice profit a stop will probably be moved to lock in up to 50 of their initial planned profits or a BE may also be put.

The list of indiors under I believe are fairly solid for sign hunting. I am sure I will be changing this list from time to time and again but for now this is what I will start with.

INDICATOR LIST:
MACD 8, 15, 9
STOCHASTIC 8, 4, 5
TRENDLINES DRAWN BY THE SHI CHANNEL TRUE (used as a range reference and TREND indior)
TRENDLINES MANUAL (ditto)
SNAKEFORCE (REMOVED)
HEIKEN ASHI...(TREND INDICATION)
SLOPE INDY ON CHART...(TREND INDICATION)

all of the above indiors are available (here I am sure) and anyplace, just google them if you want to follow.

Later once this is moving along, IF things are looking good I'll post the indior package we are currently using at the time. For now I just need to see if this is sometimes a viable guide trading system. I have done this in private with some fantastic success but I have never attempted it publicly and so I have no idea what to expect here. Also do my very best to post charts of transactions as time goes on. Please know that I conduct a complete time business in your home so there will be instances I might not be about to post a couple of hours but I will reply all articles left for me when I watch them.

I believe this is a fun, intriguing and interesting trading experiement...

Much gratitude to everybody who joins me and helps with their ideas and thoughts. Please feel free to post your personal charts provided they're of Trading Yourself. Additionally, if you have some indior suggestions or critiques generally feel free to fire away https://forexintuitive.com/attachments/1527986727.png

[godoflabyrinth]

Would you believe that I created 1200 pips this thursday, doing this specific same thing. Taking a trade opposite of my thought....and it return quite a bit. In all honesty, it was supposed to only be a bet commerce, or even a throw away commerce. Talk about luck. . .first commerce I attempt this'' on, yields this sort of return..haha. Eitherway, obviously that won't be the case too frequently as the market crashed that day. . .but still heck of a coincidence.

So far, this egy is working really well. lol.

On a serious note, I'm intrigued with this. As I have always believed in not trading what other traders also see, viewing stuff other traders don't see, as it is what hedges start looking for too and'trap' people. So technically, on some occasions we will be about the hedge's side of the trade. Which is good.

But figuring out when to trade with the crowd, and contrary to it, is still the key.

[JanaPP]

Hi supermatt, yes it certainly is and I think it is amazing how many people think it's just plain mad. I've asked in private previously well-known good traders what they believed about this and 100% of the I have spoken to told mepersonally, you can't do that. I set it off for many years in fact. But then one afternoon in disgust looking at my losing streak, I do not remember exactly perhaps 19 in a row https://forexintuitive.com/attachments/1527986727.png I chose wtf, if I could lose that many in a row... nearly a 100% reduction rate lol how can it hurt to try just pressing another button? I did and it went so well I couldn't believe it. At that time I was working on a small programing project and stopped the manual trading but since then I've wanted to start a dialog here and maybe even try it live. I'll likely do it anyway even if there's not that much attention as it's so darn weird and fun to perform. Who knows, it may simply crash and burn just like most plots do but then again perhaps it will help someone make a dollar too. Lol



I dont think thats mad, I often think the identical thing, individual psych is complied and I often have thought of pressing sell if I had been thinking of buying. Its a fascinating topic.

[JanaPP]

HAHAHA Yes I think this and it is a fantastic point! I have done something similar when I first tried trading this way I won something like 7 or 8 in a row right from the batting box. It was astonishing.

About your point below, I have come to the understanding and belief the market as we see it unfold was made to make us think that a thing will happen that really isn't. We are shown over and above historical price action and based on those ingrained patterns within our thought processes we believe we are seeing what we are not. Now I am not saying that this is some kind of conspiracy or something like this but I am also not saying there couldn't be either. All that apart, bottom line is: we view what isn't occurring, not we see what is happening if you get my drift? I will plan to start this true soon... it must be fun https://forexintuitive.com/attachments/1527986727.png

Thanks for the article Tbb...


I created 1200 pips this thursday....
As I have always thought in not trading what other traders also view, seeing things other traders do not see, since it is what hedges look for as well and'trap' folks.

[JanaPP]

I feel the first thing to do to start is to choose a trading platform style working with some of the indiors most (not all) traders may have in their platform. The most obvious are the MACD, Stochastic, and an MA or 2 and perhaps a couple of others. Just enough to provide us those perfect signs https://forexintuitive.com/attachments/1527986727.png I'll work on putting something together on (maybe) that the 15m TF.

[rickyfc]

Lol you mean set up all the common indiors that tell you to go long and force you to believe to go long that necessarily fail and you shouldve gone short. Reverse believing? It makes sense to me!

Be cool if you could bring up some examples

I am curious by this pyschology, it's difficult to dismiss it, I have been trading for a while with no success and despise every trade moving against me right away.

[JanaPP]

Exactly.
I am working on some kind of standard to use at this time and I'll post as soon as possible. Thanks for the post.




lol you intend put up all of the common indiors that tell you to go long and force you to believe to go long that necessarily fail and you shouldve gone short. Reverse thinking? It makes sense!

Be cool if you could bring up some examples

I am curious by this pyschology, it's difficult to dismiss it, I have been investing for a while with no success and despise every trade going against me right away.

[JanaPP]

Weekly trend is ranging
Daily trend is up
4hr trend is up
1hr trend is down slightly.

Stochastic was hooked down once I took this trade.
MACD is in down trend
Slope indys are down tendency.
Shi and Shake are downtrend.

LONG GAUDUSD
0.89170
tp 0.89550
sl 0.88790
https://forexintuitive.com/attachments/15279867721722013073.jpg

[JanaPP]

I am using the SHI Channel alongside all the other indiors to try and guage the trend management. Following are some example pics.


Pic #1 Weekly Trend:

Pic #2 Weekly and Daily Trends:

Pic #3 4HR and 1HR Trends:
https://forexintuitive.com/attachments/1527986778577191333.jpg
https://forexintuitive.com/attachments/15279867822112677391.jpg
https://forexintuitive.com/attachments/15279867871258865034.jpg

[JanaPP]

That was cool!

I traded against myself came out a winner on it.

Lets try that a few more shall we?

Https://forexintuitive.com/attachments/1527986739.jpg

looking for transactions as we speak...

[JanaPP]

inside this pic I drew yellowish trendines with a white arrow showing the diver in advance that's highly likely to generate a long to the upper channel in the pic.

Although trading against yourself I believe has merrit, there are a number of setups that just work most of the time. This is.

As this is a diary of trading I would not chance this trade .
https://forexintuitive.com/attachments/15279867921479345406.jpg

[JanaPP]

Okay I'm pretty certain this one should be a loser but let's see.

SHORT GBPUSD
1.50240
SL 1.51160
TP 1.48000
https://forexintuitive.com/attachments/1527986797590021567.jpg

[JanaPP]

I am afraid I may have chosen a TP too much off but encounter win or lose I will leave it this moment.


Ok I am pretty sure this one should be a loser but let's see.

SHORT GBPUSD
1.50240
SL 1.51160
TP 1.48000
A moments reflection from As a man thinketh by James Allen

Mind is the Master power that moulds and makes,
And Man is Mind, and evermore he takes
The tool of Thought, and, shaping what he wills,
Brings forth a thousand joys, a thousand ills:-
He thinks in secret, and it comes to pass:
Environment is but his looking-glass.

[JanaPP]

CHANGING SL TO BE A FEW
TP 1.50150

Since this trade is nicely into profit, I do not want it to become a loss therefore reseting SL to BE 1 or two pips.
https://forexintuitive.com/attachments/1527986802166167331.jpg

[JanaPP]

Since this trade is in profit and may return up at anytime I chose to quantify fe on last fractal and from that point I'm giving the trade 10 pips and spread =14 pips over that fe line. This wll still leave a decent profit on the transaction should it not complete the original trade TP whilst still giving it room to breath; the dashed line indies the new SL degree.

My stress is that should price go over the incline line there is a good chance it will continue maybe strongly.

On another note, if I just happened onto this chart I would say to myself... hmmmm that looks like it is going long for me personally... so then I'd brief it directly https://forexintuitive.com/attachments/1527986749.jpg So if that is the case then that may very well complete the original profit goal.... Lets watch.

Ideas anybody?

Setting TP to 1.48990 (not shown in the pic below )
https://forexintuitive.com/attachments/152798680825209431.jpg

[JanaPP]

Now is not this a treat! I was so darn sure that this eurusd chart would go up in price I didn't even wager against it ha ha ha. Look at what actually happened up to now. If I had stuck to the program I'd have been in nice profits on this particular trade Trading AGAINST Myself! Notice the little white up-arrow revealing where I called price would continue higher based on the diver only preceeding it.



In this pic I drew yellow trendines using a white arrow revealing the diver in progress that's quite likely to generate a near the top station in the pic.

Though trading I think has merrit, there are a number of setups that just work most of the time. This is one of them I think.

As this is a diary of trading against myself I wouldn't chance this trade . https://forexintuitive.com/attachments/15279868151556768655.jpg

[JanaPP]

I am currently checking out USDJPY here.

The 4hr reveals:
HA.... Long
Slope.... Long
Stochastic Long
Snake....Long
MACD isn't commited though. Hmmm https://forexintuitive.com/attachments/1527986755.pnghttps://forexintuitive.com/attachments/1527986755.png better wait a little.
https://forexintuitive.com/attachments/15279868205706218.jpg

[JanaPP]

ok we touched the BE SL and shut in a decent profit on this trade. Https://forexintuitive.com/attachments/1527986758.jpg

two for 2 so far and one I took before beginning this thread.

Okay I'll be looking out for the next potential trade.
https://forexintuitive.com/attachments/15279868251375574683.jpg

[JanaPP]

(sorry, had to delete the last message because I posted the wrong jpg)

okay let's try this one.
Stochastic is hooking down the shi lines are down however, the snake is upward. Not sure I like how the slopes are up but what the hay anyway.

LONG USDJPY 93.054
SL 92.065 (FE 61.8 4) 92.105 (spread 1)
TP 94.860 (FE 100.0 -4) 94.820
https://forexintuitive.com/attachments/1527986831325375945.jpg

[JanaPP]

LONG EURUSD 1.26340
TP 1.28000
SL 1.25900

according to:
stochastic hooking down
macd hooking down
shi down
snake down
https://forexintuitive.com/attachments/15279873531123066150.jpg

[JanaPP]

I probably didn't provide this commerce enough room to get the job done.
A higher degree would have been the FE100. I'll have to pay extra attention to this later on.
https://forexintuitive.com/attachments/1527987360168380685.jpg

[yolandarof]

I probably didn't give this trade enough space to get the job done.
A better level would have become the FE100. I'll have to pay extra attention to the later on. Every now and then the indiors are going to be appropriate, you wont receive every trade.

[JanaPP]

Absolutely!

And that's ok with me. If (and I mean IF) this style of trading can create 6, 7 maybe 8 out of 10 wouldn't that be a hoot.

It's still a brain bender when you consider it though. Yesterday evening I was sleeping/thinking... well. . When this evaluation loses a transaction it means It actually won analytically although this specific analysis is very shallow yet it is so EASY. Https://forexintuitive.com/attachments/1527987336.png

a lot of individuals especially newer traders state Trading ought to be easier; I have always agreed with this statement and still do.

Why should trading successfully be darn difficult! Now this really is a question for another thread! ... so you really have to understand and even have a sense of S/R's and market setiment. It takes lots of hours to learn correctly unless you are gifted in that arena and I know there are a few here that are yet statistics shows that there are very few.

So let's continue and see if this sort of low stress, simple, quick to learn style of trading can be profitable on a consistant basis.

We are still in that usdjpy trade (above) let's see how it stands out. By all indiors/indiions it ought to be a loser. https://forexintuitive.com/attachments/1527987336.png

!



every now and then the indiors will be right, you wont receive every transaction.

[JanaPP]

LONG AUDUSD 0.89560


SL 0.89050 (0.89190 -10 - disperse (3) -1)
TP 0.90700 (fe 10 disperse (3) 1)

stochastic down
MACD down
4hr shi down

only the 60 shi and reduced slope is up now
p.s. the spread was only 3 at the time of this commerce
https://forexintuitive.com/attachments/1527987366366969150.jpg

[JanaPP]

Just woke up and checked to find the AUDUSD Long hit the halt.
I'll return later to check for further trades that makes for 4 losses and 2 wins up to now. Since a reduction is actually a triumph (analytically speaking) and a win is a loss, I really don't know whether to https://forexintuitive.com/attachments/1527987340.png or even https://forexintuitive.com/attachments/1527987340.png now; but we'll trudge on for now.
https://forexintuitive.com/attachments/15279873722104773058.jpg

[rickyfc]

I dont think thats mad, I often think the same thing, human psych is complied and I frequently have thought of pressing sell if I had been thinking of buying. Its a fascinating topic.